I am surprised
Why does Folkalley play Swing instead of Folk?
posted byPaul Lenz on August 21, 2006, 03:36:46 pm

Carp-a-Diem!
U crack me up Paul! Find the one site on the internet with a truly varied playlist, and spend yer time carpin' about it. Hey Jim, play some Hedningarna, let's see if that fits "Folk"!
posted by Jim Pipkin on August 21, 2006, 04:39:39 pm

Folk or not Folk...
Hedningarna is 1000 times more Folk than "I Feel Like Singin' ". If I want to hear Swing, I choose a Swing station. If I want to hear Blues, I choose a Blues station. If I want to hear Folk, I choose a Folk station, and I suppose "Folk Alley" to be such a one. What's wrong whith this?
posted by Paul Lenz on August 23, 2006, 04:22:13 pm

All connected
Because it is all connected, Paul - swing, jazz, blues, folk - all fruit from the same tree. All "Folk" music, because fer sure it ain't horses playin' it. All of those genres are as interrelated as an Appalachian town. When I go to coffeehouses I hear all styles, and I admire FA for keeping that variety on their playlists. Glad you like Hedningarna, though, I just can't believe the energy they deliver. Almost as good as the Klezmer Mountain Boys...
posted by Jim Pipkin on August 23, 2006, 04:36:47 pm

Sure
Of course all is connected. Folk, Swing, Jazz, Beat, Rock, Pop, Rap - all is connected. So what? But if a station names itself "Folk..." there should be a limit "we play this and we don't play that". Imagine you go into a Chinese restaurant and order "pork meat sour-sweet" and they bring you a Hamburger and say "it's connected, there is also pork meat" - would you eat it gladly? For Hedningarna: I like their style how they perfectly mix European Folk with Orientalic Folk. But actually I don't like groups or singers, I only like pieces. There is no group and no singer of which I like all pieces. For example I like SkrauTv?l but S?gl? Ten is really boring.
posted by Paul Lenz on August 23, 2006, 11:35:25 pm

Blog debate
We debated this whole genre thing in the blog string "What Should We Call This Stuff?" - it ran to over 400 posts, and we just kept circling around. To some people, Blues and Swing are Folk. In this case, those people are DJs that set the playlists. I don't like everything that plays on the Alley, but I'd rather they err to wide format than narrow.
posted by Jim Pipkin on August 24, 2006, 07:25:56 am

I'm sick and tired of idiots, morons and imbeciles
"If I want to hear Swing, I choose a Swing station. If I want to hear Blues, I choose a Blues station. If I want to hear Folk, I choose a Folk station, and I suppose "Folk Alley" to be such a one. What's wrong whith this?"--Paul Lenz What's wrong with this is that you're an idiot. No, excuse me, I meant to say imbecile. My bad. I would suggest you check out the "Anthology of American Folk Music" on Smithsonian Folkways, and perhaps subscribe to the Journal of American Folklore, although I'm afraid that some of the words might be a tad too big for you. People like you want to compartmentize everything. If it doesn't fit in your moronic preconceived notion of what "folk music" is all you can do is bitch and complain. It wouldn't be so bad if you actually had a clue, but it's obvious to anyone with half a brain that you don't. "Imagine you go into a Chinese restaurant and order "pork meat sour-sweet" and they bring you a Hamburger and say "it's connected, there is also pork meat" - would you eat it gladly?"--Paul Lenz Maybe someday radio stations will let you order off a "menu" just like a Chinese restaurant. Then you'll be able to remain blissfully ignorant. By the way, hamburgers are beef, not pork. You're not even bright enough to make a decent analogy. And believe me, I like pork. In the words of one of my favorite folk singers, Bo Carter, "Pigmeat is what I crave." You, on the other hand, should probably dust off your old Brothers 4 records because you aren't ready for anything more challanging. Thank you.
posted by Lucky Guitar on August 24, 2006, 11:11:53 pm

OK, you convinced me
[QUOTE=Lucky Guitar]What's wrong with this is that you're an idiot. No, excuse me, I meant to say imbecile. [/QUOTE] Well - let them play whatever they want. But then they should rename "FolkAlley" to "EveryMusicHighway".
posted by Paul Lenz on August 25, 2006, 04:21:44 pm

Paul, you don't get it.
Paul, you simply don't know what you're talking about and obviously don't care to learn. I referred you to a couple of sources that might help you with your definition of "Folk Music." Basically, blues IS folk music, you dunderhead. You'll never understand that, much less accept it, so I'd suggest you simply deal with it. There are lots of people in the world who know more than you do. I know it's tough, but that's the reality of the situation. Blues, jazz, swing, gospel, klezmer, polka, in fact any music you can name is, or grew out of, folk music. Fortunately for you they've reissued the Limeliters.
posted by Lucky Guitar on August 27, 2006, 09:41:12 am

Nonsense
[QUOTE=Lucky Guitar]Paul, you simply don't know what you're talking about and obviously don't care to learn. I referred you to a couple of sources that might help you with your definition of "Folk Music." Basically, blues IS folk music, you dunderhead.[/QUOTE] Just keep on with this, boy. Maybe it doesn't take long until they install a Lucky Guitar Rude Words filter because they mind your words more than me. Anyway... if blues were folk, they wouldn't call it blues, they would call it folk. Blues came from folk, but it was something else, so it got a new name. That's the simple story. A leaf is not a branch, a branch is not a trunk, and a trunk is not a root. A Porsche is not a Volkswagen. And blues is not folk. It is a long chain: Folk -> blues -> rhythm & blues -> rock'n'roll -> rock -> funk -> hip-hop -> rap. Where do you want to put a border between FolkAlley music and non-FolkAlley-music? But probably you think rap is folk, I would not be surprised.
posted by Paul Lenz on August 27, 2006, 03:57:19 pm

Rap is definitely Folk Music
If we are defining folk music as music from the heart of a unique community, rap is folk music. The best rap tells stories, and follows a tradition of putting life to rhyme that goes back thousands and thousands of years. Also, I have yet to meet a folkie singer/songwriter who was better at spot rhyming than most rappers. Pure improvisation, pure cultural transmission. Plus I like the sexy videos.
posted by Jim Pipkin on August 27, 2006, 09:42:29 pm

Funny...
The "Recent Song Discussions" list shows that a reply exists, but it is not here. Was it deleted by the Lucky Guitar Rude Words Filter or by a filter which triggers when "rap" and "music" appear in one sentence?
posted by Paul Lenz on August 28, 2006, 02:26:00 pm

Buggy page
Oh, when I post a reply, I see my answer and the previous answers. There seems to be a limit of 10 entries but there is no link to the next 10 entries. I will inform the webmaster.
posted by Paul Lenz on August 28, 2006, 02:33:47 pm

Limit of 10 Song Comments
The problem limiting the number of song comments to 10 has been fixed. - Chuck
posted by Chuck Poulton on August 28, 2006, 04:25:02 pm

Folk or not Folk
[QUOTE=Jim Pipkin]If we are defining folk music as music from the heart of a unique community[/QUOTE] Should we? So please give some examples for what is NOT folk music in your opinion and why not. In my opinion, folk music is definded by a kind of melodies, harmonies, and arrangements which DON'T have a long chain of stylistic development behind them.
posted by Paul Lenz on August 28, 2006, 11:42:28 pm

Examples? Sheeeeeesh.
Explain that to the folk musicians among the Yoruba, Paul, or the folk musicians among the Zulu, or the Watusi - a folk music tradition going back thousands and thousands of years, with intricate harmonies (Zulu and Yoruba and Congolese call-response songs, passed down now into American Gospel) and other incredibly ancient forms based on physical movement and syncopation. The dance is half of the song in African folk music. More than half. Your definition of folk is TINY - far too small for me. You are living in a tiny little eurocentric box when you think of folk music, and I for one don't intend to spend the next twenty years trying to bring you up to speed. Nothing but love for ya, Paul, but y'all need to get out more! Now please - have your last word, 'cause I'm so done with this debate, I really am.
posted by Jim Pipkin on August 29, 2006, 12:22:11 am

Definition
[QUOTE=Jim Pipkin]Your definition of folk is TINY[/QUOTE] Why? Your examples exactly meet my definition: they all don't have a long chain of stylistic development behind them as blues, swing, or rap have. I asked you a simple question, but you want to avoid to answer. This is also an answer.
posted by Paul Lenz on August 29, 2006, 11:30:37 pm

Acid rock, electronica, and anything by Yanni
These , I feel, could safely be excluded from Folk. But rap, especially street rap, blues, gospel, swing, bluegrass, Irkutsk throat singing, Finnish wind-raising chants, gypsy fiddling, and countless other forms too numerous to list, even when accompanied by electronic instruments, are included in my definition. Native American flute? Folk. The Moody Blues? Folk. The guy who can play the Star Spangled Banner with his armpit? Folk. The one-man-band playing the banjo while keeping time with knee cymbals? Folk. The astronuat banging rythm with a wrench on the space station cooler ducts and wailing Leadbelly tunes? Folk. Our definitions differ, Paul. You like things in boxes, that's cool. I prefer big open smorgasbords that surprise me. And yet, here we are, arguing on Folk Alley. Kinda cool, huh?
posted by Jim Pipkin on August 30, 2006, 12:32:12 am

I agree
[QUOTE=Jim Pipkin]These , I feel, could safely be excluded from Folk. [/QUOTE] And why? [QUOTE=Jim Pipkin]You like things in boxes, that's cool. I prefer big open smorgasbords that surprise me.[/QUOTE] There are tons of surprising music left to play which I can call folk music. You don't know what I am prefer, but I am not an Omnivore who eats everything what they throw in front of him, who agrees to everything and who is nodding all day long. [QUOTE=Jim Pipkin]And yet, here we are, arguing on Folk Alley. [/QUOTE] Yes, but I would prefer the Folk Alley Blog for this.
posted by Paul Lenz on August 30, 2006, 11:08:33 am

Been done
I'll let someone else start that string. IMHO it's been done to death. No two people agree, period.
posted by Jim Pipkin on August 30, 2006, 11:47:18 am